In this podcast episode, Madeleine Mickeleit welcomes Jordi Cruz, CEO of Zentinel, and Björn Engelbert, Business Developer at Perinet, to talk about technology-related use cases at source level and integration level. This episode is perfect for anyone looking to implement use cases at the shop floor level or in the building segment. It covers what to pay attention to when implementing standardized data collection, how to integrate different machines on an existing shop floor, and which components can be used to save money.
Episode 139 at a glance (and click):
- [11:19] Challenges, potentials and status quo – This is what the use case looks like in practice
- [23:50] Solutions, offerings and services – A look at the technologies used
Podcast episode summary
In this episode Björn and Jordi detail their partnership where Perinet supplies the hardware, while Zentinel adds value through software and integration.
They explain that Perinet’s technology involves Single Pair Ethernet (SPE), which allows for data communication and power over a single cable, facilitating easier and more flexible data acquisition. Their periNODEs, small adapters attached to field devices, locally process signals and transmit data in real-time using MQTT, either to local or cloud-based systems. This approach bypasses traditional PLC and SCADA systems, making digitalization simpler and less invasive.
Zentinel leverages Perinet’s technology to offer tailored solutions, particularly focusing on calculating metrics like Overall Equipment Efficiency (OEE) in real-time directly at the machine level. This eliminates the need for extensive data processing infrastructure and provides immediate, actionable insights.
The discussion concludes with information on upcoming trade fairs and an invitation for new partners to collaborate with Perinet and Zentinel.
Podcast interview
Hi Björn and Jordi, it’s great to have you here. Björn, how are you today?
Björn
Hi, thanks for having us, Madeleine. All good. Looking forward to the podcast.
Perfect. How are you, Jordi?
Jordi
Very well, thank you, Madeline. We’re pleased to be here and look forward to the conversation.
Perfect. Maybe we could start with a short introduction. Jordi, you have a background at HARTING, right?
Jordi
Yes, many years ago, I worked for Rockwell Automation and Honeywell, gaining insights into automation, control, and information. Then I spent 10 years at the HARTING Technology Group as managing director of HARTING Iberia. HARTING introduced a revolutionary industrial edge computer, which spun off into Perinet. That’s how we knew each other, and when we started our company in Spain, Perinet was the obvious choice for our technology.
Nice. Greetings to the HARTING teams if someone is listening. Björn, when did you first meet Jordi?
Björn
It was years ago. I already knew Jordi from his time at HARTING Iberia. We were in contact because, even back then, we were looking at use cases for the edge computer Jordi mentioned. When we took over the IP for this edge computer from the HARTING Technology Group, we continued to work together on use cases based on that technology. Jordi and his colleagues have taken the base products we provide and developed them further to add value to the market.
Yes, we will dive into how your technology works. But let’s start with the use cases in different projects. We’ll discuss what to consider when implementing projects like this. Björn, could you give a brief introduction? Perinet provides IoT components and technology. Can you explain your customers and the use cases you cover?
Björn
Absolutely. We are a spin-off of the HARTING Technology Group but relatively small, about 20 people. Our focus is on developing and marketing base components. These components enable customers to get information directly from the field level.
We use Single Pair Ethernet technology to make field level components, mainly sensors and actuators, networkable. This offers flexible topologies, security, browser-based configuration, and dashboards. Essentially, our components turn field level sensors or actuators into network computers.
Nice. We’ll get insights on how that works. If you’re wondering what SPE is, we’ll explain it in a second. Sorry for interrupting, Björn.
Björn
No problem. We are a pure base component provider. Our clients are primarily sensor and actuator OEMs—original equipment manufacturers who use our periCORE communication module to add networkability, security, and other features to their products. We are active in various markets, mainly industry and building automation. However, our most important customer segment is value-added resellers like Zentinel. While we focus on the base product, we rely on resellers and system integrators to adapt our products to specific market needs.
I see. You’re partnering with Zentinel to provide a complete solution for your customers.
Björn
Correct.
Okay, Jordi, can you explain a bit about Zentinel’s partnership and the use cases you cover? Björn, you’re more on the technical use case level, focusing on data acquisition and standardization. Jordi, where do you come in?
Jordi
Yes, Perinet started with an industrial edge computer, which was revolutionary back in 2015. They expanded this concept to intelligent adapters that can read machine or sensor signals and transmit that information over Single Pair Ethernet. At Zentinel, we leverage the computing power in these adapters to add information processing capabilities at the signal level. This eliminates the need for an edge computer or cloud-based data processing.
In one simple periNODE we can calculate the overall equipment efficiency (OEE) in real time, locally, and send it directly to a database.
Challenges, potentials and status quo – This is what the use case looks like in practice
Starting with the OEE use case is great because many listeners are setting up typical use cases around OEE. It’s a good example to understand how your technologies work. Let’s dive into the challenges or pains behind this use case. Jordi, what’s the technical challenge in solving this use case?
Jordi
In manufacturing, companies invest heavily in information systems and machine automation. However, automation does not equate to digitalization. Extracting data from automation controllers, such as PLCs, to information systems can be complicated and expensive. Unless all machines use the same type of controller with identical data structures, data extraction is difficult and costly.
Our approach avoids the controller, directly accessing signals from the machines. Perinet’s technology allows us to read discrete outputs from a PLC and, from a single signal, infer average cycle time, production counts, and downtime locally. This is revolutionary.
Björn
Yes. Jordi summarized Perinet’s mission well. Before founding the company, we saw that many in the industry wanted to digitalize but found it cumbersome, time-consuming, and costly. Our mission is to provide components that make field-level data acquisition easy, efficient, and economical. This allows companies like Zentinel to create use cases that deliver fast and easy results for industry participants.
Jordi, can you explain the different data acquisition cycles and data types involved?
Jordi
Perinet adapters can read signals directly from machines, such as PLC outputs or photoelectric sensors. We typically deal with simple on-off signals to detect cycle times or production units, pulses from utility meters, and analog values like pressure, temperature, and levels. Working at this low level reduces the amount of data transmitted across the network.
How often are these data types sent?
Jordi
With Single Pair Ethernet and Perinet components, data can be sent up to 10 times per second. Theoretically, we can update machine OEE or analog signal evolution every 100 milliseconds. It’s user-configurable, so the user can choose the update frequency.
I see. You talked about real-time data from different assets and PLCs. What about IT system data? Are you integrating IT systems in these use cases, or is it just real-time data from different asset types?
Jordi
No, we provide data and information that the user can use directly. We’re standards-based and have two main mechanisms for sharing data. We use MQTT as the real-time protocol, publishing everything the ZentNodes produce through an MQTT broker. Users can access the data in real-time through this broker. Additionally, the periMICA edge computer runs a SQL database, allowing any product that can read from a SQL database, such as Excel, Power BI, etc., to access the information.
Solutions, offerings and services – A look at the technologies used
I see. So, to solve this use case, it’s not just real-time data from PLCs but also IT system data. Do you have insights into the technology requirements customers ask for in your solution? What’s important to them technically?
Jordi
Customers want accessible information. We have customers at various stages of digitalization. Ultimately, they want data in an open format so they can connect their IT systems. They want a solution that’s open, simple to implement, and doesn’t require re-engineering the machine, allowing them to plug in their information systems and read the data.
All right. Let’s understand how your integrated solution works. Perinet handles hardware and data acquisition, while Zentinel provides an integrated solution for various customers. Could you explain this integrated solution in a few sentences? Then we’ll dive into details like data collection and transmission.
Jordi
A traditional Industry 4.0 system includes PLCs, SCADAs, and information systems. The PLC reads machine signals and converts them into data, like temperature, counts, etc., which is passed to a SCADA system to make it IT-ready. We move everything one step down. PeriNODE devices convert signals into data directly, calculating cycle times, temperatures, alarms, etc., locally. The periNODEs handle what the PLCs typically do.
Instead of using multiple servers with a SCADA system and historian, we use the Perinet edge computer. The edge computer has an MQTT broker receiving information from local devices and a SQL database logging every information package.
Okay, so the first step is data collection with your components from Perinet. What kind of product is that here, and what should I pay attention to if I want to implement standardized data collection? What’s important from the hardware side?
Björn
Our focus is on IT/OT convergence—bringing data from the field level into IT systems for analysis, helping people understand their production better, and enabling optimizations. We’re not competing with automation systems; we focus entirely on data acquisition. What clients do with the information from our devices is up to them or companies like Zentinel, who build specific use cases.
Our products, the periNODEs that Jordi mentioned, are smart adapters that attach directly to any sensor or actuator in the field. We offer various interfaces depending on the sensor or actuator type: a 0-10 volt interface, a PT100 interface, and a two-channel GPIO. These cover the majority of sensors and actuators. We are also working on additional interfaces based on client needs.
For data acquisition, you attach your sensor to the periNODE, adjust settings in the browser to calibrate the sensor, set up security, and you’re good to go. As Jordi mentioned, you just need to define the MQTT broker, and you’re ready to start.
I see. And what’s your USP here? Many customers go through traditional automation systems, like SCADA, and get data directly from the PLC. What makes the periNode special?
Björn
The main difference is that you don’t have to touch the PLC to acquire the information you need. There’s a saying: Never touch a running system. Interfering with existing systems can cause issues. Our solution runs completely parallel to the automation system—an independent data acquisition system. You can install it anytime you’re ready to digitalize your processes without interfering with your current setup.
Jordi
The periNODEs are designed for on-machine installation. They are IP67 rated, making them resistant.
They can be installed directly on the machine, operating between -25 to 75 degrees Celsius. No need to open the automation cabinet. You can wire the periNODE to an existing detector, saving installation costs.
With Single-Pair Ethernet and additional services from Perinet, there’s no need for network configuration.
Right. To clarify, SPE, or Single Pair Ethernet, is an Ethernet technology that transmits data over one pair of copper wires, a development from traditional Ethernet that uses at least two pairs.
Björn
Correct. We’re using the hybrid variant of SPE, with one cable containing four wires: two for 100 Mbps data communication and two for a 24V DC power supply at 2 amps, providing 48 watts of system power. This is used for the last meter of data acquisition from the machine.
We don’t replace infrastructure items; we acquire data directly from the machine over the last few meters.
Understood. Jordi, could you explain how data processing works, whether in the cloud or on-premises?
Jordi
In a typical IoT system, sensors send data to the cloud for processing, then the processed information is sent back. We simplify this process by performing basic signal processing at the periNODE level, a device three centimeters long installed directly on the machine. This handles calculations like cycle times and temperatures. Processed information is sent to the MQTT broker in the Perinet edge computer and stored in a local SQL database.
Customers can control whether they want cloud processing or not.
So the data analysis happens at the customer side, right? Customers can choose to do OEE or other use cases in their own cloud applications or directly on the machine. They can decide how to handle the data analysis, correct?
Jordi
Correct. While our preferred method is local processing, the system is standards-based. The periNODEs, being MQTT clients, can publish data to an MQTT broker in the cloud. So this is also possible.
Björn
It depends on client preferences. Some are open to cloud-based IoT platforms, while others prefer on-premises solutions for data security. We cater to both, as Jordi explained.
Yes, especially with new requirements like the Cyber Resilience Act enhancing digital security in Europe. It’s good to have flexible options.
Björn
Correct. Our products are already Cyber Resilience Act-ready, with certificate-based security built-in. Clients using our products, and thereby Zentinel’s products, are prepared for upcoming legislative requirements.
Perfect. For more on the Cyber Resilience Act, I’ll include a link to a relevant episode in the show notes. One last question: For partners or system integrators interested in setting up these use cases, how do you handle partnerships?
Jordi
Zentinel MDS, based in Barcelona, Spain, works with system integrators in Spain, Argentina, and Brazil. Our products are designed for ease of use, suitable for any solution provider that can connect devices to a machine. We need partners familiar with basic technologies like SQL databases and Ethernet TCP/IP. Interested companies can contact us via email or our website.
We are looking for more partners, so feel free to reach out.
Great. We’ll include your contact details in the show notes. Check there to get in touch with Jordi or Björn and discuss partnerships or next steps. Björn, will you be at the Hanover fair this year?
Björn
Yes, we attended Hanover fair this year and plan to be there next year. For the remainder of this year, we won’t have our own booth, but our products will be featured at the SPS fair in Nuremberg in November.
We’ll be at the SPE Forum in Munich at the end of October. It’s a two-day event with workshops and presentations on SPE technology. We’ll see where we showcase our products next year.
Great. If you’re listening before SPS in November 2024, consider attending. I’ll include all relevant info in the show notes. We also have a community meetup on Tuesday at 5 PM at the OPC Foundation booth. You’re invited to join us. So SPS is confirmed. Will the Barcelona IoT World take place in 2025?
Jordi
We don’t know yet. The last event was in May, and we haven’t received updates. Together with Perinet, we organized an event during the IT Solutions World Congress, and we will likely do the same next year.
Perfect. I’m considering attending the Barcelona fair next year and would like to strengthen connections on-site.
Thank you for today’s episode. I now have a clear understanding of your technology, use cases, and integrated solutions. I appreciate your time and would love to do a follow-up episode next year. Thanks for being part of this, and I’ll hand it over to you.
Björn
Thank you, Madeleine. We’re always developing new products and interfaces, and we’ll be glad to share updates when ready.
Jordi
Thank you for the opportunity.
Thank you, and have a great week. Bye!